Smells Like Humans
Top 5% global podcast! Smells Like Humans is a seasonal podcast dedicated to bringing a humorous perspective to quirky and curious aspects of human behavior. Each show, the SLH crew will focus on a different topic, and share personal stories and observations in a way that sounds like you’re hanging out with your funny friends. The stories and commentary are presented with humor and warmth, since let’s face it: we all smell like humans. (Contact us: contactSLH19581980@gmail.com)
Smells Like Humans
PUT THOSE PACKING PEANUTS DOWN!
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Caitlin joins Ross to discuss whether sometimes it's better to change how you live before changing where you live. Tangents include: Rabies in the UK; Baby Toes Johnson; old men; movers and hot dogs; TSA; cat litter smugglers; and if you are patient, maggots.
Contact us: contactSLH19581980@gmail.com
And you know, when two years go by and you're pushing the old guy down because you're sick of him. The point is, is that Are you? No, I mean you're not. You're not. You wouldn't do that. No. No one should push the old guy down. Just don't do it. You might want to, he might deserve it, but that's not an excuse to do it. Unless it's dark and you can get away with it. But I'm not suggesting that. Okay, I'm here. Welcome to another episode of Smells Like Humans. This is the podcast where we explore the curious things that people do, the very human things that grab our attention and cause us to wonder what and why. I'm Ross, your host, and my guest today is an absolutely fabulous and talented actor, director, maker, yoga monster, dancer, teacher. So many things that if she were in a toolkit, she would be a Leatherman EOD multi-tool with a cap crimper, carbon scraper, bolt override tool, and a replaceable C4 Punch. It's Caitlin. Hello! Welcome to the show. So great to have you and welcome everyone to the show. This is the place where you belong. You are welcome here. Pull up a chair, a couch, a futon. What else can they pull up? A hassock?
SPEAKER_02A Zambuton.
SPEAKER_01Yes, please pull up a Zambuton.
SPEAKER_02Get in there.
SPEAKER_01Get in there. Sit on the floor. Crush your legs. Be with us. We are glad to have you. We appreciate you. And this is the place to be. Now we know Caitlin. People like to move around. People move for jobs, for family, for relationships, for adventure. We move because we're bored. And sometimes before or after we do this, we ask ourselves, was this really worth it? So, Caitlin, the last time you were on the show, we were talking to you from Jolly Old England, specifically London. You had moved there for several years. I don't know how long you've been gone, but you recently just got back. That was kind of a major move. So I thought, who better to talk to about the moving experience, the trials, the tribulations, the good, the bad, the ugly than my dear friend Caitlin. So how does it feel to be back? You've been back a few weeks now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Uh how's the re-entry been?
SPEAKER_02Oh my lord. Yeah, there's I mean, moving, I I've moved um within this country many times, but moving internationally, that's a whole other kit and caboodle.
SPEAKER_01Can you recommend it to others?
SPEAKER_02Oh you my question would be if you're moving internationally, do you have a thing you're moving for? Are you moving for a job you're super passionate about, a degree that you're gonna go do? Um is there something that is gonna provide you some sense of grounding? And if the answer is no, if the answer is no, then maybe sit on it a little bit. Maybe sit on it.
SPEAKER_01You just sit on it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I mean, moving to London, part of what made it possible was I moved to go to grad school.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02And I I don't consider myself like um living in an enormous city like London is not my long-term vibe.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02Or part of my long-term plan. But I knew that I could handle something like that if I had something that I was moving for. Right. Like I'm gonna go get my degree, that's gonna be my focus, that's what I'm, you know, and I can enjoy my time there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02As so long as I've got that kind of focus and that energy.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And so was it since you had a specific uh goal that you were trying to achieve, which is getting a degree, which did you get? Did you get the degree?
SPEAKER_02As of I mean, yes, and as so on December 1st, I will technically graduate, uh, and then I will have the degree.
SPEAKER_01You flunked out, didn't you?
SPEAKER_02I did. I did. We moved to London for two years, and I totally, yeah. No, no. I yes, I have my MFA in actor training.
SPEAKER_01Congratulations.
SPEAKER_02Thank you. Thank you very much.
SPEAKER_01So since you had that goal and you you've almost earned it, allegedly. Allegedly, yes. Then then I'm wondering now, would you say it was worth what you went through?
SPEAKER_02Like a thousand percent.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so it was all worth it. So, but was it easy or hard to do? And what was easy or hard about it?
SPEAKER_02I mean, what's your what's your guess? Like, is it easy to move across half an ocean and re-establish your life?
SPEAKER_01I think the the hard part is this the ladder, the re-establishing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01The moving a bunch of junk, I don't know if it matters how s how short or long the distance is, although I'm sure there are international complications.
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01Uh, which which I'm sure there are many, but I think once you commit to stuffing your junk in a box and sticking it in a car or moving van, then the biggest challenge is first of all, doing that. And then, but then the biggest challenge is setting up your life again.
SPEAKER_02I'm gonna disagree. Yay!
SPEAKER_01Gosh, you have no idea how important that is for this show.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I mean, at least, I mean, yes, I think it to some extent I've always enjoyed the process of moving because I love packing.
SPEAKER_01Um you love packing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, especially if I've got enough time to do it.
SPEAKER_01Wow. What do you what do you love about packing?
SPEAKER_02I like the process of going through my stuff and going, I don't need this anymore. Why have I held on to this? And like letting it go. And then I like the process of going, I'm gonna hold on to this, this is gonna come with us to the new place. And I like organizing. So I like like, oh yes, it's gonna go in my suitcase like this.
SPEAKER_01Oh, so you're meticulous. You're thoughtful. You're thoughtful. So when I move, I hot dog roll everything in like blankets and then wrap it all up with Chinese tape and just fling it into a vehicle.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_01So that's faster. It is, but the stuff sometimes gets broken.
SPEAKER_02I wouldn't say I'm a fast mover.
SPEAKER_01No, but you're thoughtful.
SPEAKER_02But I like, yeah, I like I like moving as an excuse to go, huh? What are the material things that are gonna inform me, guide me on this next journey in my life?
SPEAKER_01Oh my gosh, I am so jealous of your brain right now. Just to have a brain that would even ask that question rather than how fast can we get there?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So the part of the reason I'm disagreeing with you is that when I look back on it now, the moving process in and of itself was so was so fraught with challenges for us that when I when I cast my gaze on it now, I'm like, you know, I really think this was foreshadowing. This was this was the universe being like, hey Han, you've signed up for this journey and you think it's gonna be hard, but just you wait.
SPEAKER_01Oh, wow. So do you have an example of what was so hard about it? I mean, yeah.
SPEAKER_02We oh, I forgot to mention, we also moved with our cat.
SPEAKER_01And COVID was like in full swing then, right? While you were doing that, so then bureaucracy was all thrown off. So you had to let the cat go, I'm guessing.
SPEAKER_02No, no, we we made it, we made it work. She came.
SPEAKER_01The cat made it? She did. Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_02We we like to call this not my uh you know, trip to grad school, but rather Beans International Territorial Expansion.
SPEAKER_01Beans is the Beans is the name of the Bean is her name. Bean.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's right.
SPEAKER_01Bean. I thought you told me it was Baby Toes Johnson.
SPEAKER_02That was that was your brilliant addition to her.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. They both start with a B. So you you didn't hot dog roll your cat.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_01You packed the cat up, your cat got all the forms filled out.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I guess they ask the same health questions they ask of us when we go to a doctor. It's like, have you ever had Do you have rabies? Yeah, do you have rabies? And I didn't know England or UK was rabies free.
SPEAKER_02They are.
SPEAKER_01Congratulations over there to our friends that listen to the show in the UK. Way to be rabies free. How long have they been rabies free? How did you get rabies free?
SPEAKER_02I have no idea. That's crazy.
SPEAKER_01But bump up. I'm editing that. It's stupid. But rabies free, I didn't know you could be rabies free. We're not rabies free here, are we?
SPEAKER_02No, well, they're an island. They're, you know, it's probably a little easier when you're Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well, yeah, islands. I can see how that would happen. Do they have snakes there? What's the snake situation in the UK?
SPEAKER_02There's no I'm gonna get this wrong. There's no venomous things.
SPEAKER_01There's no venomous things.
SPEAKER_02I think that's right.
SPEAKER_01There's no venomous things.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so you can wander out in the woods and feel free and easy because And you should actually I'll highly shout out to the UK's woods. You should wander in those woods because they are beautiful.
SPEAKER_01Now, do they say the woods or the wood?
SPEAKER_02Oh, I don't know. I'm not sure.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. I've heard people from Europe talk about the wood. The wood. Like it's just one.
SPEAKER_02The wood sounds ominous.
SPEAKER_00The wood. The wood. Come out to the wood and get rabies.
SPEAKER_02So one of my favorite stories is that so we were we were bringing our bean, our bean. Okay. Yes, keep that. We're bringing our bean into the UK. And uh so of course we have cat litter with us because over the course of this essentially 24-hour journey, she's got a pee at some point. So we have this like travel sized litter box, and we have like these little plastic baggies full of cat litter in our carry-on.
SPEAKER_01What did Bean think about all that?
SPEAKER_02She was not a fan, uh, as evidenced by the fact that she never used it. And then when we finally arrived at our Airbnb in London, she did the longest pee of her life.
SPEAKER_01Wow. Yeah, it was very impressive. And you timed it?
SPEAKER_02No, but it was, I mean, it was intense. So we're moving through security.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_02And we've got these cat litter bags in our carry-on, and I've got the cat. So one guy motions to me and is like, we're gonna take you into this room so that we can scan the bag and you're gonna hold the cat while we do that. Right. And Jordan, my husband, has the cat litter. So Jordan's going through security, and the the security guard pulls him aside, and his face like lights up because he thinks he's made the biggest bust of the century.
SPEAKER_01He's packing drugs.
SPEAKER_02Oh my God. He's so excited. He's like, promotion is on the way. Here I go. He pulls out the bags and he shows my husband and is like, what is this? And Jordan is like, Oh, I'm so sorry. Like it's it's cat litter for our cat. And he he scrutinizes Jordan and is like, but where's the cat?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, where is the cat?
SPEAKER_02And Jordan's like, Well, she's with my wife, who you've just taken into this other room. So there's this tense, awkward moment. Oh, wait.
SPEAKER_01So you're in a room, Jordan's in a room, and the cat's in a room.
SPEAKER_02That's right.
SPEAKER_01Nice. Yes. Now everyone's being interrogated to see if they're telling the same story. They think your husband is packing drugs. That's right. Smuggling, he's a smuggler.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So he brings the cat in. Yes. And what does the cat say?
SPEAKER_02I finally come out of the room and Jordan's like pointing frantically at me and going, That, that one, she's my wife. That's my wife.
SPEAKER_01And in that moment, your value as a human being in his life went so high. So high. It may have never been higher. There may be another peak somewhere down the road, but at that moment, he probably was like, Thank God, this person is 87% likely to confirm my story.
unknownYes.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, really hoping that I walk out with a cat in my arms.
SPEAKER_01With a cat and also pretending that, you know, I mean not pretending, but acting like you were supposed to act and not deciding in that moment to play a very funny little prank.
SPEAKER_02Oh, I've never seen you before in my life. What are you talking about?
SPEAKER_01This isn't your cat.
SPEAKER_02I don't know who you are. I imagine that would have been your response, Ross.
SPEAKER_01It would have been tempting. But I I can read the security room. I tend I tend to I I tend to straighten up. What well usually I tend to straighten up when um there's prison on the line.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01So, okay, so back to so you he's not obviously prosecuted for drug smuggling.
SPEAKER_02He is not, no. And the look on the securities guard, the security guard's face was of deep, deep, profound disappointment.
SPEAKER_01Disappointment. Oh. Did he did he keep the uh litter or did he give it back?
SPEAKER_02No, he did give us the litter.
SPEAKER_01Because a lot of times they like take stuff away from you.
SPEAKER_02They do, yes. But no, that was fine.
SPEAKER_01Well, you're having all this exciting adventures, you're smuggling drugs, you're wrapping cats, you're hot dog rolling cats and stuffing them in crates. That's right. And then you're going to a foreign country, you're getting a degree, you're making all your new friends and contacts, and you're having all your experiences, and you're almost going to graduate, maybe. You so for you it's gone really fast because you have been over-stimulated with all kinds of not only stress, I'd say good stress, bad stress, all the adventures. But here, nothing happened. And it seemed like it went on forever, day after day. And everybody would say, Is Caitlin around? And where is Caitlin? Caitlin's not here. How about her cat? No. How about her little drug dealing business? I guess that's not working either right now.
SPEAKER_02I think a lot of things happened in Portland during that time.
SPEAKER_01Oh, well.
SPEAKER_02I remember talking to you about moving, and you have, in my opinion, a very unique energetic uh connection to moving.
SPEAKER_01Well, I've moved a lot. And at every level, like when I was younger and had less money, they would help some, like maybe just provide the truck. And then finally all the way up to doing all the packing, the part that you like doing. But I don't really like the I like the I like going to new places, but I don't like the process of getting to the new place. Like having all your stuff smashed into boxes and sticking on a truck with a bunch of unreliable characters, and then it gets to the other side and it gets dumped out on a on a lawn or in a parking lot in a big heap.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And then you gotta sort through it and see what's not busted.
SPEAKER_02It gets dumped on a lawn.
SPEAKER_01Well, it just depends who you hire. Um one of the things I don't like about the you know, when I don't know how it is now because I'm trying not to move anymore, but uh uh most of my experience when you hire a company, they send out a person to your place. They're often very neatly dressed and groomed, and they look at all of your things and they're very polite and they're very welcoming, and you want to be their friend, like you want to hang out with them, they're so nice to you.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And you serve them a cup of tea or a coffee, or a beer or whiskey, depending on their mood. Wow. And you hang out with them, and then they tell you, you know, this is what it's gonna be like, and this is the date, this is how it'll work, and here's what it's gonna cost, and here do you want the insurance? All the it's great. And you feel like I love this company, they're gonna take care of me, yeah, and they're all gonna just watch over my stuff and all these assurances, and then the moving day comes, and that person, whoever that person was, is nowhere to be found. Right. Because they're just an estimator. Yes, they're the face of the moving company. Yes, but the real people who are doing the work look like they just fell off the back end of a tugboat.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_01In a like a wharf somewhere.
SPEAKER_02What do you mean by that?
SPEAKER_01Uh they're rough around the edges.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_01They may be ready, but they're definitely rough. So there's the driver person who, in my case, has always been uh kind of a bigger dude who seems to know what's going on. And the other people who we will call the helper people seem like the last time they moved anything was never.
SPEAKER_02Really?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they are look, they were picked up off a street corner at about 6 a.m. that same morning, and they have no freaking clue. They're just pairs of hands that are gonna help trend, and then the the driver guy is like the boss telling them uh-huh, take that, do that, not that way, lift it like that, don't lift it like that. Because they've never done this before.
SPEAKER_02Well, okay, okay, interesting.
SPEAKER_01So there's a that creates stress. See, so what I don't I don't want to watch any of this. I'd rather not know. Because they're gonna drop stuff, they're gonna bang stuff, they're gonna scratch stuff, they're gonna break stuff. I know that's gonna happen, but the mistake for me is to watch it. It's too stressful.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I worry about the guys, and then you gotta feed them, you gotta water them and feed them. You got to, you know, because they can't just be doing this work with no food.
SPEAKER_02I'm only giggling because the you make them sound like they're your new houseplants.
SPEAKER_01No, but you know, they're working, they're working stiffs. You gotta keep them going, you gotta slip my hot dog or something. Anyway, so uh I've never so it's there's a to me, there's a disparity between the the the face of the company that does the estimate and what ha actually happens. And I just I hate that whole process. I like to skip it somehow.
SPEAKER_02There's I just I just have to say, there's someone in your audience right now who does work for a moving company who is who perhaps is cringing because I've never hired anyone to help us move before, but I have recently um a friend of mine hired someone to help her move. And these two men, and I I will also point out that it seems like the majority of folks in that business are men for all sorts of reasons, but uh the two the two men that came to help her with her moving process do not fit the descriptions that you just gave.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02They were excellent. They and they were, I would not call them rough and ready by any stretch of the imagination. They were really attentive, they like laid down like a carpet inside the house so that they wouldn't get footprints anywhere. Um, they were really conscientious with like how they were moving things, they were very efficient. Um, so I just want to offer that in case you have any listeners who are on the moving end of things and are trying to um anyway, there's another perspective on movers.
SPEAKER_01You've been smoking that cat litter, haven't you? When I was younger and didn't have as much money, I did hire a company to help me transport, not pack, but just transport boxes and furniture. Yeah. And we didn't have it much. And the the moving company said, you can pay a flat rate, which is this, or you can pay by the hour, which is this. So I'm looking at the two things and I said, we don't have much stuff. I think it's gonna be cheaper to do it by the hour, you know, because it's like it's just not that much. Sure, yeah. So the characters show up in the morning, uh-huh, they know they're working by the hour. Uh-oh. And of course, you know, two hours earlier, they are outside of Costco, like looking for cigarette butts. And so now they're like, oh, I'm gonna get paid, but it's only by the hour.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01So they're moving slow, uh slow, slower than slow. To the point where I realize I'm looking at my watch, I'm looking at the stuff, I'm looking how slowly it's moving. I'm realizing I'm gonna be in big trouble with my cash situation because this thing's gonna start, they're just gonna keep rolling, running the clock out.
SPEAKER_00Wow.
SPEAKER_01So it's like a cab driver drives you all over, you know, to get yeah. So I'm like, uh oh, I'm in a bad situation. So I start running up and hustling boxes down myself, like really fast. Like I'm sweating, I'm running up and downstairs, bringing stuff out, throwing it on. Yes, and they're like, What's going on? I'm like, uh, we're doing this. So I'm doing it, and they're still moving slow. One guy comes up to me and he's like, I need a hot dog. I gotta go drive out, get him a hot dog. He's not even doing anything. I need he just says to you I need a hot dog like that.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_01I need a hot dog. When somebody says that to you, you gotta you gotta respond to it. But I don't know how I would respond. You go and get the man a hot dog. Okay. He's gotta have it so he can continue to do nothing. So I get all the junk on the truck and they're doing like about a third of my speed. And I'm just running, running, running, running, doing it all. And so then I'm still it's still gonna be really close. And I do not want to be wrong about this decision I made. So when we get to the other house, because it was only it was only like 20 minutes apart.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01We get to the other house, it was a rental house, and fortunately it had a garage. And I just said, we're throwing all this crap into the garage. Like you're not loading anything, just get it off the truck to me. I'll put it in the garage and I'll deal with it later. And that's exactly what I did. And then I had to, of course, all move it all into the house and deal with all that. But that was the only way. It would have been a fortune if I'd let they would have been doing it for days. I mean, I don't know how many hot dogs I would have had to buy. Just the hot dog bill would have been beyond my estimate. I have to I want to propose something to you. I want to propose a moving cycle. And I want to see if you think this is the stuff of behind a lot of moves, because people move all the time, and there's always almost always reasons. So here's the cycle. You start looking for a new place to live. Some for some reason, who knows why. All the reasons. And during the looking period, there's what I like to describe as excitement and wonder when you finally figure out where you're gonna be. There's like an excitement. We're going to a new place.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And when you get there, there's the there's the excitement and thrill of like finding the new coffee place. Oh, this is a good place. Where you get your groceries. Oh, we met a new person today. They like to play Scrabble too. We're gonna be best friends. Sometimes there's just new weather, you know, like it's hotter here, it's nice, it's warm, it's cold, it's snowy, it's whatever it is, but it's all new and it's exciting.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So there's a lot of novelty. It's new, new, new, and that keeps you going for a while. Yes. I can get two years out of the novelty when I move. Like two years of excitement and fun and meeting new people, and oh, there's a place, it's an old movie theater, but they put on like comedy, open mic, and it's just like, wow, cool is that. Of course, they had that junk in your old town, but you never went to it. No, of course. But the idea of being in this new place, suddenly you're this new person who goes to this thing, maybe. And then after the novelty starts wearing off, then there's a period of adaptation, and then you start rationalizing some. Like, well, it's maybe not that great, but it's still good. I mean, there's kind of a lot of traffic, or there's kind of a lot of cold weather, it's kind of a lot of rain, like here in Portland, or snow, or old people, or whatever you don't like. Yeah. And but you kind of just go through a rationalization period. This is just a general model I'm I'm uh laying out for you. I'm with you so far. And then you start thinking, well, you know, maybe it's not so great. You know, maybe, maybe it's not so great. And the dissonance for some people starts to grow like this is not working out. Things are not as great as I thought they were gonna be, not as exciting. The people I've met, they're okay, but some of them are bums. There's a guy like with weird teeth, you know, is he really my best friend? Because I don't want to look at that. Whatever. Things are like starting to look be more realistic. Maybe the job that you went for, the school or the whatever, the family, the romance, whatever you were chasing, maybe isn't quite working out the way you thought. Or even if it's all going fine, you notice that despite of every, you know, despite the fact that everything's fine, you find yourself in another routine. The same routine you busted out of to start this whole new life. In like two or three years, oh, I'm just doing, yeah. Well, I'm just I still go get my coffee at this place, and I still do this, and I still do, and there's nothing really that interesting happening. And, you know, maybe you did a drastic thing, like you move from the city to the country, or in your case, you move overseas, or you move from the country to the city, and it was really exciting. But eventually everything turns into a routine, and you say, you know what I need to do?
unknownI need to move.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_01And then you start to looking all over again and start to cycle again. And if you're like me, I've done that so many times, it becomes kind of this addiction.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because you want the fun two years again.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01So you that means you end up moving a lot. Here is my moving trajectory. Okay, ready? New York to Maryland, to Florida, to Maryland, to Los Angeles, to Bellingham, to Nebraska, to Virginia, to Maryland, to New Jersey, to Los Angeles, to Texas, to Virginia, to Portland.
SPEAKER_00Wow.
SPEAKER_01And within those places, sometimes I moved house more than two times.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_01You know, I would move two or three times in these places.
SPEAKER_02Right. It sounds like it's a lot of moves. It sounds like you were seeking stimulus.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02Something new for your brain to like on it. Grab onto.
SPEAKER_01You are on it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I am a restless person. And so moving for me was a way to address that superficially. Because I start feeling restless. I start feeling no matter how good things are, no matter how good, no matter how interesting my life is, and how many friends I have and what all things we're doing, I never felt like I was bored where I was, but I just start feeling restless. And so the way I would address that is to go somewhere else, completely different. And that's why I'm here. I came here just to see what would happen.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. There's something about that that feels very core to human conditioning. Um and perhaps as I'm thinking about it, perhaps capitalist conditioning.
SPEAKER_01Okay, tell me about that.
SPEAKER_02Which is that uh happiness is always over there, not here. Or sat or satisfaction, maybe is a better word for that. Um if I and and the the narrative to me goes like this it goes, if I just do X, or if I just get X, or once I move to this city, or once I achieve blank, then I will feel satisfied or happy or fulfilled. And it's this it's this picture of our of our self-satisfaction, our our contentment as being always perpetually out of reach.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But there is always this hope that if I just do this next thing, I'll eventually reach it and then I can rest. I can enjoy things. But I can't enjoy things until I get.
SPEAKER_01Well said, Professor. Um, that's good. I think that's right. I call it the chase. Yeah. We're encouraged to be on the chase all the time. We're encouraged to be dissatisfied with what whatever it is we're doing, no matter how much we have or how little we have or what we're doing or what we're driving, where we're living, we're constantly being told it's you, it's not enough. You have to chase more, do more chasing. And most of these moves that I listed, not the moves within the places, but from state to state that was was to chase education or chase a job.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And so I'm not saying that automatically because you have an opportunity to get more education, or you have an opportunity to get a bet better paying job in your field, or to have an opp an um an experience that you want to have, that it's always a bad thing. But I think that that in general, you know, the chase, that pressure of the chase that you'd always need to be chasing is can be at the minimum a distraction, and it can also bring a lot of unnecessary stress into your life. Yeah. In my case, I know there was some element of the chase driving all this, but I think as time went on, I kept doing this and I didn't need to be on the move. I had gotten all the school I was going to be allowed to get. I mean, I'm not like you. I can't get into fancy places in London. I can't even go to London. I thought the salve to my restlessness, the solution to this feeling of being unsettled wherever I was, was that I needed to change my environment, change my friends. I mean, it's not like I'm getting rid of the old friends, but it's like go have new experience. As opposed to looking inwardly and thinking about what things can I work on personally, or what different choices can I make without actually physically relocating. So is this a psychological journey or is it a geographic journey that I need to be on? And I think superficially my answer for years was, oh, it's geographic. I don't even want to think about. I'm not, I'm not even going to think there's nothing going on with me. But what I what I started really focusing on is, you know, this restlessness may just be just an urge for novelty or an urge or a suggestion to, you know, an inner suggestion to to either seek out some new experiences or new people in my area.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Or it's an urge to kind of take a look at some of the choices I'm making and and how I'm spending my time and what's drawing my focus and whether there needs to be a recalibration of that, without actually packing a bunch of junk into a box and heaving it onto some trash barge and sending it on its way.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And so that's what's kept me here now in Portland. I'm in my ninth year. I never stay anywhere nine years.
SPEAKER_02Wow, congratulations. I'm I'm healthy and well. Yay!
SPEAKER_01That's my story. For most moves, there's gonna be always be a significant component of I have to do this. I need to do this for family, job, romance, something, learning, education, just uh improving my situation, following my passion, following my bliss, all of those things. So that's always gonna be a piece of the pie, and probably a significant piece. But I just start wondering like this to the extent that somebody is being driven by this chase that you described more eloquently, you know, a few minutes ago, this this desire to like always be striving and reaching for some goal.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And then when you get there, it's like then I have to go to the next thing and next thing and next thing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01What do you think? What's your reaction to this?
SPEAKER_02I I really like the moving cycle that you proposed. It made me think about if that feels true to my experience. And I think in some ways it does, but in some ways, my experience of moving as a cycle is a little bit different. I feel I feel like I I definitely experience the the high or the buzz of looking at new places to move. And also, like I want to throw out that my context, I'm very lucky that my context for moving has always been by choice. Yeah. And there are plenty of people who have moved not by their choice.
SPEAKER_01Right. Or they want to move and they can't. Their circumstances are are direly constrained.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Um granted.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So so when I'm moving by choice, there is, yeah, there's always that sort of excitement about looking at new places to live and sort of and the imagination process of like, yeah, what's my life gonna I love that. My new my new life, my new me.
SPEAKER_01My new shiny life.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. But again, it is always that it it always assumes that whatever's happening in the now isn't enough.
SPEAKER_01Yep.
SPEAKER_02And that is, I think that's a piece I've been um that has been a constant part of my personal internal practice in trying to um remember and affirm that me, myself, and my experience as it is now is enough. What I mean by I am enough is it's to for me, it's related to the ways in which we are conditioned to believe that in order to belong in various places in our society, we need to change ourselves in order to fit in. So um, when I practice the affirmation of I am enough or my circumstances are enough, it is essentially a practice of awareness and gratitude. What's here, what's happening in my experience, and can I can I find for me, it's almost like a childlike wonder or awe of like, can I hold that wonder of like that is what's happening right now, even when the shits hit the fan. I actually did this um just like two nights ago when I was sitting in a tremendous amount of anxiety because part of the consequences of moving back to the United States after having lived in London for two years is that we have no money in our bank account.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um, and so because of the drug habit.
SPEAKER_02Because of the cat litter drug habit, correct.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's really, you know, really gotta show that one.
SPEAKER_01I hear what you're saying.
SPEAKER_02Right, but it's the it's um but actually at this point in my life when I have the least amount financially, I've actually been experiencing the most amount of gratitude, and I have been more aware of things that are in abundance than I have ever felt in my life.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's really cool. Because you're you're still relatively young compared to some people in the room, and it took me quite a while to get there where you are now already. If you're chasing something, you know, chase gratitude. Yeah, if you're chasing something, chase acceptance, you know. I know in the real world, because I've lived in the real world, believe it or not, some of the time, there's this tightrope between genuine novelty seeking, like I want to travel, I want to see, I want to meet different people, I want to see something outside my little town, my world, whatever it is. And this other pathway toward acceptance and gratitude and sort of being settled and looking for novelty within your con the confines of your actual milieu rather than trying to create an experience by going somewhere else.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01Because my argument is and this is not a new idea. In fact, there's the old saw, everywhere you go, there's there you there you are, right? And it's this idea that that after those that's to me, that's what's happening after the two years of excitement of meeting new people and new coffee shop, a new grocery store. And look at that old guy. Oh, yeah, he walks by here every day. And oh, isn't that cool? And you know, when two years go by and you're pushing the old guy down because you're sick of him. The point is, is that are you? No, I mean you're you're not. You wouldn't do that. No, no one should push the old guy down, just don't do it. You might want to, he might deserve it, but that's not an excuse to do it unless it's dark and you can get away with it. But I'm not suggesting that. Okay, I'm here. That's all you were chasing. Right. It's it's it's ephemeral, it's just very temporary. It just floats away, and there you are again. Then you're back. And you're the same person and you're dealing with the same issues, and yes, there are externalities that have changed, but really it's the same game being played. So, but I I think it's a tight rope because especially early on, you you were kind of set off, you know, on this chase journey, chase success, chase something, chase monet money, chase family, chase all these things and show what you have.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And it's so it's hard to moderate and say, hold on a second, do I really need to do that?
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_01So that's really I just wanted to have that discussion with you because I know you just you're in the middle of you just did this.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And and and it was two years, interestingly enough, according to your Were you ready to come back after two years?
SPEAKER_01Or did you feel like I wish we could do another two years of this?
SPEAKER_02Uh yes and no. Um it leaving was very bittersweet for me.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um, I I definitely and this will relate to sort of my take on your moving cycle, which I'll share in a minute. But um I by the time the two years were beginning to wrap, I was finally really feeling in a very embodied way a sense of um, oh, I live here. You know, I had our grocery store and my tea place and a routine that felt very comfortable and easy to move through. And so I always find that once I've hit that routine place of like, oh, okay, I'm just now beginning to feel like the day-to-day is not a constant influx of new information.
SPEAKER_01You start feeling like shoving that old guy.
SPEAKER_02I do not know.
SPEAKER_01No, I'm I'm saying metaphor, I'm using it as a metaphor. I know you would never do it.
SPEAKER_02Uh I I if you're using it as a metaphor for like where is the new stimulus? Yeah, I actually more what I feel like is oh, my brain space is not taken up so much by all the you can relax a little bit. That's right. So now I feel like I can have brain space for things that are more creative or thinking more broadly about, you know, my career or how I want to put energy into the world.
SPEAKER_01Such a good point because that is where it needs to go. And in my case, I think the thing that I wrestled with for so many years is that when I would get to that space of, okay, finally I know what's happening and I have all my stuff and everything's going great, is I didn't do that. I didn't say, okay, now's the time for me to dig in and think about how what I'm going to do now that I have the brain space to do it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And that is what I'm trying to do now. And I'm coming up empty. I got no, no, no, but that's kidding. But but you're, I think that's exactly where it needs to go. Rather than realizing that, oh, I'm in a routine, it's not exciting anymore. I need to change this up. And I think it applies to relationships too. People bounce from relationship to relationship because it's like, oh, so now all the party time is over, and now it's just kind of normal.
SPEAKER_02Daily life.
SPEAKER_01Daily life. Yeah. I gotta shake it up. I gotta find the new excitement.
SPEAKER_02I mean, spe so speaking back to your moving cycle, like I've definitely recognized that after I I like your two years, but there's like different shifts that happen to me on different timelines. So the first part, whenever I'm landing in a new place, landing, whenever I'm landing in a new place uh after moving there, the first you know, year is exhausting. And particularly the first like three months, I take, I take naps. I I sleep more because I find yeah, I find that the input of new information on a daily basis is exhausting. And that's where I am right now. Like currently, my body. Um, in fact, yesterday I hit a wall and recognized that I was like, I've overextended myself. And I don't even feel like I've necessarily been that busy, but for my brain right now, it is a lot.
SPEAKER_01And people don't know this because of editing, but I've had to wake her up three times just during this podcast. Her head just slumps down, and I like either she's asleep or dead. And if she's dead, that's a problem because of the body and where we do it and wanting to be alive. Well, yeah, and that part.
SPEAKER_02Right. But then after, you know, after three months, I'll begin to feel like, okay, all right. Some things now I don't have to think about. I can move through a grocery store, shopping list, don't have to think about it too much. Right. Um, but after, and then after a year, I find that I begin to feel like, okay, I'm beginning to have a community. I'm beginning to have a sense of I know where people are that are in my bubble and I feel like more supported in that way.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_02And I think you're right. I think by two years, there's a real there, you begin to have a real sense of like ease of like, I know this place.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I know this place. I know how to move through it. I know my place in it. Um, I know my relationship to it. Right. And I think I was just beginning to feel that in London.
SPEAKER_01And you were ripped out of that.
SPEAKER_02When we left, yes.
SPEAKER_01And now you're back.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Well, um, I I'm personally in a very selfish way glad to have you back. I want to leave our avid listeners with the thought that it's probably a lot cheaper and less disruptive and less stressful to change how you live before you change where you live, even though sometimes you will change where you live. But if you're chasing that novelty drug, not the cat drug, not the cat litter drug, but if you're chasing the novelty drug, because that's what it was for me. I was just wanted I see I loved I never took naps during the first two years. I was taking it all in. I was just so much fun for me. Yeah. To have all the excitement of everything happening. Um, but but if and if that's your main motivation, take a moment to think about well, how am I living right now? So I'm feeling restless. What is driving that? Is it really a geographic thing? Do I really need to chase this next job? Or do I need to maybe change up some of the things I'm doing with my time here? Because there's lots of people in your own little place, in your own little town, even the building I live in that I've never met.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I don't want to meet them, but but there's experiences, it's all right there. And uh it's fun to think about it. And it was fun to talk to you about it. So thanks for coming all the way back from London to do this podcast. We could have done it remotely, but I appreciate your effort.
SPEAKER_02Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01And did your cat make it back?
SPEAKER_02She did.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay. I'm glad that you decided to hold on to her after all going through all that trouble.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, she's doing great.
SPEAKER_01Was it easier to bring her back than it was to take her? Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01She's like, here we don't care.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_01Bring your rabies, bring your rabies, whatever else kind of disease you've got, bring it here. We don't care.
SPEAKER_02No, but for her it was easier because there was definitely a recognition of like, uh, I don't like this, but I've done this before.
SPEAKER_01I've done this before. I know about the little baggies and I know how to use them.
SPEAKER_02That's right.
SPEAKER_01Well, thank you again for being here, and thank you to all of you for listening to this show. We appreciate you being there. We appreciate your support. You can always reach out to us on Instagram or send us an email. People do that and they find that we're very interactive. We love that you're here and that you support our show. And we hope you will tune in to another episode because whether you are hot dog rolling a cat in a blanket or using your husband as a drug mule, it's important to remember that we all smell like humans. Goodbye, everybody.
SPEAKER_02One time my partner and I were moving from California to Oregon, and we had found this place for us to live on Craigslist. Um, some of you are already raising your red flags. And you would be correct. One morning I felt something fall on my shoulder and was like, that's weird. Why is there a piece of rice falling from the ceiling? Ooh, rice. And then the rice began to move. Whoa, what? And I looked up at the ceiling and there were maggots crawling.
SPEAKER_01Oh, shut up about that. Ceiling. Freaking horror movie.
SPEAKER_02Now I have maggot trauma.
SPEAKER_01Oh my god.
SPEAKER_02I cannot handle them.
SPEAKER_01Maggot trauma. Was there a dead body up there?
SPEAKER_02I don't know. That's where maggots are doing. We were like, we were like, what could it possibly be? Is she storing meat in the attic?
SPEAKER_01Meat, bodies, body parts, no things. It was terrifying. Oh my god, how long did you last there?
SPEAKER_02Only a month.
SPEAKER_01Telling me you got the hell out.
SPEAKER_02We did. We only stayed there a month and then we're like, never again.
SPEAKER_01That is so disgusting. I had no idea. You were so gross.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01No. Uh that sounds horrible. I'm glad you did not stay there. Me too. And thanks for sharing that story and let that be a lesson to you kids out there.