Smells Like Humans
Top 5% global podcast! Smells Like Humans is a seasonal podcast dedicated to bringing a humorous perspective to quirky and curious aspects of human behavior. Each show, the SLH crew will focus on a different topic, and share personal stories and observations in a way that sounds like you’re hanging out with your funny friends. The stories and commentary are presented with humor and warmth, since let’s face it: we all smell like humans. (Contact us: contactSLH19581980@gmail.com)
Smells Like Humans
IS THERE SOMETHING WRONG WITH ME IF I JUST CAN'T FIND A "GOOD" FRIEND?
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Tracey the therapist joins Ross to discuss if there are any good friends out there and how to find them. Curiously, the two discuss how important it is to have someone who will help you bury a body.
Contact us: contactSLH19581980@gmail.com
I like driving around with bodies in my truck. We don't need to go into why, that's a different show. Welcome to another episode of Smells Like Humans. This is the podcast where we explore the curious things that people do, the very human things that grab our attention and cause us to wonder what and why. I'm Ross, your host, and my guest today is an ass-kicking therapist and someone who knows your way around an artist's palette. It's Tracy.
SPEAKER_00Hello. Thanks for having me, Ken Ross.
SPEAKER_01It's great to have you back. We're doing this series that you and I discussed at least a year ago, focusing on a theme that we have explored before, which is is there something wrong with me if? And today we are asking the question: is there something wrong with me if I just can't find a good friend? So I'm glad that you're here to talk about that. Tracy, we know a good friend can be hard to find. And even if you do happen to find a good one, things can happen which erode the friendship, screw things up, or maybe the person isn't the good friend you thought they were. Or life just changes. Right. And I've been lucky in my life to have made many friends. My friend to enemy ratio is quite high. But out of all these friends, how many would I classify as good friends? Maybe just a handful.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And some of the ones that I would are on the bubble, I gotta tell you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Right?
SPEAKER_01They're on the bubble. So part of what I'm wondering about is what a good friend what does that mean? What what what psychologically speaking constitutes a good friend?
SPEAKER_00We all need a sense of being enjoyed, of having someone delight in us, of you know, having someone that we feel like to tell our like not so pretty parts to, and they go, Yeah, okay, I see you. Yeah. And I'm still in, right? Or that makes sense. Right? Like we need people who care about us as is. And that you know, it's there's like this lore about the friend you meet when you're in kindergarten and you have them until the day you die when you're 97 years old. And that's rare because people shift and change over time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I went to kindergarten with a lot of punks.
SPEAKER_00Sure, right? You don't even want them.
SPEAKER_01I mean, come on, those kids were.
SPEAKER_00I mean, not as good, no good, right?
SPEAKER_01But yeah, so and and then would you say so? I like the way you put that, someone who recognizes who you are, likes you anyway, yeah, enjoys you, takes delight in you. But I think a big thing for me is that I think people need to show up when they when it's time to show up.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01It's okay. I like, yeah, let's we have a good time together, but sometimes you need to show up for a friend.
SPEAKER_00Totally.
SPEAKER_01For a good friend. If you're a good friend, do you agree that you need to show up sometimes?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I I think, you know, that's that's to be defined too.
SPEAKER_01I mean, I think help me bury a body, that's what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I would totally help you bury a body.
SPEAKER_01Okay. I'm gonna move on. Put me on the list. I'm moving you up on the list.
SPEAKER_00Good, good. I want that's what I was hoping for.
SPEAKER_01Moved up.
SPEAKER_00Three spaces. Okay. Wow, three.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's a big jump.
SPEAKER_00Good. Would you also help me? No, that's fine. Don't even answer that.
SPEAKER_01It's no, well, wait, you help you bury a body? Of course I would.
SPEAKER_00Oh, good. All right.
SPEAKER_01Of course I would.
SPEAKER_00Like I thought I could count on you.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you can count on me. I like burying bodies. I like I like driving around with bodies in my trunk. We don't need to go into why. That's a different show. This is not as something wrong with me if I have bodies in my trunk.
SPEAKER_00No, no, no, no. That's a different episode.
SPEAKER_01Something wrong with me if I can't find a good friend. Sure. Although those two things may be connected in my case. They can go together. The smell alone can be repelling to friends. Okay.
SPEAKER_00I mean, I think, you know, I really am a big fan of the book All About Love by Belle Hooks.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Belle Hooks, I remember Bell Hooks.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, right. I think I keep revisiting her. She just seems to get more and more relevant for me, probably as I get older. But All About Love, I think, talks a lot about what how to define love, right? That love is this overarching umbrella, and underneath that are these different parts to that. And I think different people in our lives can offer some and maybe not all. And like what I think about a good friend is someone who has more of those pieces, right? Like trust, respect, affection, you know, uh these parts. And you know, I too have been really lucky in my life to have really wonderful friends, the people that I'm like, you know, I have a pretty big list of people that I could call if something went really wrong.
SPEAKER_01That's nice.
SPEAKER_00And it is nice. And hopefully I'm on their list too, right? Right. Because I I want that to be reciprocal. And you know, adult relationships are conditional. And that means both people in the relationship need to show up and create conditions for that relationship to be satisfying for both people, whatever that means to them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I think that is not easy to find because at different places in your life, you may have more time and energy for something than someone else does. And you may be longing for a connection that they're not able to show up for, that has nothing to do with you, just has to do with convenience, or you know, you have little kids and they don't, or they have little kids and you don't, or they have a job that has more, you know, you have more time than they do, or you know, I I think especially as adults when we're out of school, then I mean it's kind of like friend dating, you know?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00You're like trying to first you go on a coffee and see if that works, and you're like, maybe we should have lunch.
SPEAKER_01There are apps where you can look for friends. There are. That's one of the ways people do it these days. I I think one of the big obstacles or things that something that gets in the way of our perception of who our friends are is we put these unrealistic expectations on people that we never discuss. Yes. So I create a contract in my mind for you that you've never been party to, we've never discussed it. And then when you violate one of the key tenets of my this contract, I'm furious with you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I feel like you've let me down when you never signed up to the body bearing, or you never signed up to babysit my kids, or you and it's, you know, and you never signed up maybe to reciprocate some of the things that I do for you. Like, well, I bring you food and I cook for you, and I, you know, fix your car and I do these things for you, and you don't do anything for me. And in your head, you're like, well, he just likes doing stuff for me.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01But we never had this deal.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01And and so my point is I think a lot of our disappointment or when we feel we've been betrayed or let down by people we thought, I thought you were my friend. It was like, well, we never really agreed on what that even means. Right. But I don't know if it's realistic to sit down with somebody and have that conversation. I don't know how you get there.
SPEAKER_00Why wouldn't it be in some ways? Like, I think that's really interesting. I think that we don't do a great job of that in intimate partner relationships, much less in friendships.
SPEAKER_01True.
SPEAKER_00And I think it'd be so great if we were to say, you know, hey, I'd like to be the kind of friends who blank, you interested in that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right? Like I have a friend who recently was like, hey, remember back in the 90s, 90s when people used to call before, you know, without texting first? I was like, yeah, she's like, can we do that? Yeah. I was like, yeah. She was like, cool. I also want to be the kind of friends who spontaneously ask for plans instead of having to text and put it on the calendar. You want to do that? I was like, Yeah. I do, right?
SPEAKER_01Like when you were kids and you'd come out in front of somebody's house and say, Can John come out and play?
SPEAKER_00Totally. Right. And I really appreciated that she brought that to the table. And I was like, oh yeah, I want to be that kind of friends. You know, I have friends who I'm like, hey, would you be available to be my emergency contact?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right. Like I I need would are you available for that? And you know, that that would mean this. Are you up for that? Like you get to say no if that doesn't fit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And finding those people. And I think, and I'm not saying I always do this well, but I'm saying when I have done it, it feels so good.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00And but it is friend dating, right? It's like, oh, you slowly build to those things. And sometimes you discover, like, oh, we're not as good a fit for going any further with this friendship. It it just stays in this realm.
SPEAKER_01That is so important. I I had to learn that the hard way, but I I learned that instead of t taking a disappointment as a negative, yeah, it's a friend telling you this is the kind of friend I can be. Yes. So I can't be, you might give me a ride four days out of the week, but I can't give you a ride even one day. Yes. And it's like you can be mad about that, you can think how unfair it is. You can say, I don't even want to be this person's friend. But the reality is it's like they're saying to you, hey, I'm a great friend for this and this. I'm just not this person. Yeah. So then that tells me, okay, so when I think of this person, I don't need to think of them as my best friend. Right. They're just a person that I like, you know, playing sports with or go to the movies with, or we have good conversations, but they're a crappy reciprocator.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Like they won't do jack for me. And I know that. And so they're just not in that space. Right. So I'm never going to be disappointed again.
SPEAKER_00Have you heard the phrase or the term or the whatever? The don't go shopping for ice cream at the hardware store.
SPEAKER_01I feel like I've heard it.
SPEAKER_00It's maybe from me. But the like no doubt. You know, the idea of like, oh yeah, there are a lot of cool things at that hardware store, but not ice cream. Like, there's a lot of cool things at that friend's hardware store, but not airport rides.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right? They're not an airport ride friend. They're not an emergency contact friend, but they're a pickleball friend. Right.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. You know? And it's these expectations, I like our filter for that, I think, can be distorted. Yeah. We're placing these expectations on people. We they've never signed up for them. And we maybe don't even understand them very well. We just know when we feel like we've been betrayed. Yeah. So I think what you're saying is very helpful. It's like, well, just have different containers for these people. Yeah. The the, you know, this is the party person. This is the party friend. This is the movie friend. This is the intellectual friend. Right. And then, you know, maybe it's getting the, you know, three or four of these people in your life that is satisfying. Yeah. And maybe none of them are are this ideal perfect from kindergarten friend, the person who knows me best. I mean, I've seen people with lifelong friends. I've got some friends that I've known since high school. Yeah, but they don't like me.
SPEAKER_00Well, we hang out, but you're like, but is this you know it's funny? So I have a friend that I went to visit in New York just um last weekend, and we've known each other since we were eight.
SPEAKER_01Wow.
SPEAKER_00And I think it's so cool that we're still friends.
SPEAKER_01It is great.
SPEAKER_00Right? And not just like, and I truly feel like she's a friend, not just someone I know from when I was eight. Like I really can have real conversations with her. And when we do, I'm like, oh, you know me in a different way. You may not know, like she lives on the East Coast, like we don't talk all the time. She doesn't know all the details of all the intimacies of my day-to-day life. Right. But we can drop in and have real conversations, and she knows me from so long ago, right, that it's different. And I really value that, but she's not my day-to-day friend.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And I think that's so in it's so great when if you in whatever your friend mix is, you have at least one person. Sometimes there's people in your family, you know, depending on, but is there one person you know that's been around for most of your story? Yeah. I think that's such a good resource. And in my case, there's you know, there's three guys who I've known since, you know, I was a teenager.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And and none of them, none of them like me. Sure. But they have to be. We still hang out. We do stuff and we laugh and we have a good time. And there's just a an easiness to that.
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01And no one ever tries to pretend they're something that they're not because we already know. We've seen the story.
SPEAKER_00We've seen the whole story.
SPEAKER_01We've seen you. Right. We've seen you with your head in a toilet.
SPEAKER_00Totally.
SPEAKER_01We've seen you wearing a chef's hat and a speedo.
SPEAKER_00Yes. When you were 14.
SPEAKER_01No, it was last week. Sure. So that's the weird thing. That's the weird stuff. But it was hot. So, so yeah, so I think, you know, I think one solution is maybe, you know, stop looking for that really good friend. Or what make that a don't necessarily make that a goal.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think when we're adults looking for our best friend, we set ourselves up for this unrealistic. It's like trying to live in a rom-com, right? It's like though that's not real, it's a fantasy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Would you agree that finding a friend when you're older is harder?
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01Because we we're, I think we're more specific about what we want.
SPEAKER_00I think so.
SPEAKER_01When we're younger, it's like, well, uh yeah, we we hang out together. Yeah, we hang out, we're in the same class, we we both have the same kind of interests. We like this sport, so let's be friends.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01As opposed to later in life where you're like, well, I need to have a little bit more in common.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Than just adjacent lockers.
SPEAKER_00Right. Yeah, I think that's absolutely true. I also think it has a lot to do with how we view ourselves, how we what messages we give around about ourselves, and how much we're, I mean, how much we're getting out of the house, how much we're being in person with people, or online, right? Like plenty of people make very close friends, you know, online that they do gaming with, or they have other activities with. I think that's possible, right? I think people have very deep relationships with people they've met online. I think that's or at least think they do. Or at least think they do.
SPEAKER_01Do with that portion that they're sharing. Um totally.
SPEAKER_00At least that portion. But I think people, I think, you know, if you meet someone online and you're getting together with them regularly and playing Dungeons Dragons or some other kind of thing, I think there are groups that get together and do that. And and they have real conversations during those games and they, you know, create depth and they share intimacies about their lives. I think that's a legitimate way to create connection. It's not my way of doing it, but I think there are people who find that really satisfying.
SPEAKER_01Well, and we get each, as you said this early on, we each get to define what that means to having a good friend, because some of us don't want to have intimate conversations. We want to be with that person, we're playing a game, whatever it is we do, we meet for bridge, we play golf, we we go to the theater, whatever we do, we take walks, yeah, we talk about politics and gripe about whatever, and that's what we do. There's a group of guys who sit outside my building at this coffee shop every single morning and they talk about world events. And I know this because I walk by them and they're talking, but they're they're enjoying it every day, and it doesn't have to be this deep soul connection necessarily, can be, can be, but it can be the depth, the intimacy or the depth of whatever it is can actually be objectively shallow, is what I'm trying to say. So it's just it's it's a small fishbowl, but man, when they're in that fishbowl, they feel like this is a great connection.
SPEAKER_00Well, and you know, for those guys, like they plan on that every morning, they show up. They if if John doesn't show up, they're wondering what's up and they're and they're gonna check on him. Yeah, and that that matters, that feels seen, that feels heard. Someone's listening to you. Like that you show up matters. You know, there are people who I know at different, you know, I did CrossFit for a really long time, and those relationships, like I'd show up, we didn't um some of my friends I still have from there, a couple of my closest friends I still have from meeting there, and we are in each other's lives regardless of the gym. But some of the other people, like I knew them very I see them several times a week, and we would see each other and know what was going on in our each other's lives. Right. Those were friendships, not the depth of other friendships, but they were really valuable.
SPEAKER_01Right. I think one of the questions that that one should ask is do you really want friends or a good friend?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Or do you feel like you should have? You should have a good friend.
SPEAKER_00I think that's where I was kind of touching on. We have this lore or this rom-com idea of like we're supposed to have this friend that we've known forever, and this depth of someone who knows us inside and out, and all those things. And I think it sets us up for feeling like we're failing if we don't have that.
SPEAKER_01Right. Right.
SPEAKER_00Versus like, and then we put pressure on ourselves and we tell a story about ourselves that we're not the kind of person who has that kind of friend. You know, there are the people who have a whole lot of friends that are more shallow friends, or what someone might define as more shallow friends, and there's people who have like just a handful of people that they can count on.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Or I don't know. We man, we tell stories and then we judge ourselves based on those stories. And I don't know how helpful that is. And I think it limits us on being like, oh yeah, that neighbor that I see every day that if something went wrong and I knocked on the door, they'd help me.
SPEAKER_01Like that's a friend. Right. That is a friend. It's no secret that, you know, the you know, people on the social meads will have hundreds and hundreds or thousands or millions of followers, friends, whatever you want to call them. And I'm just wondering if that distorts how we even think about real friends.
SPEAKER_00There's some research a number of years ago that talked about how each person really only has the capacity to have maybe 10 or so.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's even less than that. It maybe six. It's like five to six.
SPEAKER_00Five to six, right? That are truly clo how we would define close friendships.
SPEAKER_01Because it's it's not just developing the closeness, but the the work that's involved in attending to the friendship.
SPEAKER_00Yes, investing in that.
SPEAKER_01If you have more than five or six, that study or studies show that you can't really give them the attention that they need to invest to feel like they're important to you. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I think that's true.
SPEAKER_01Online, you can do that with hundreds of people by giving little thumbs up and hugs and hearts.
SPEAKER_00Right. That's not a true emotionally connected relationship.
SPEAKER_01No, you don't even know these people.
SPEAKER_00You don't know them.
SPEAKER_01You've met them one time or they're a friend of a friend of a friend, and now they're just part of your big hug heart group.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01I'm wondering if that the social media experience, on the one hand, the superficial connections kind of keep us propelled in this sort of endless loop of checking our phone and make sure, you know, checking our screens and making sure we're getting the connection. I don't know. I don't know if that interferes with actually having connections. I mean, what do you think?
SPEAKER_00I mean, I think that it can make us have a false sense of connection and actually still feel very lonely.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00You know, like but you could have thousands upon thousands of followers and have no one to be like, you want to come over for some tea?
SPEAKER_01Well, and the thing, yeah, exactly. And I think sometimes we get out of practice. So but one of the things that happens, if you're in an elevator with a stranger, 99.9% of the time, they will not talk to you, they will look at their screen. Right. Because whenever we're in a situation, a social situation that creates any hint of anxiety, we immediately go right to our screens and we scroll. And we're looking for help me. Right. Distract me. Distract me. Keep me safe in my phone bubble.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01And you know, I think we're out of practice with saying hello.
SPEAKER_00I agree.
SPEAKER_01Excuse me.
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01How are you? Uh-huh. Have a good day. Now it's perfectly normal for 10 people in a crowded elevator all to be looking at your screens and holding their breath and hoping that the door opens on their floor as soon as they're going to be able to do that.
SPEAKER_00And no one will talk to them and they can get out.
SPEAKER_01Don't talk to me. Don't ask me anything. Don't say anything. And if you do, it's very threatening. And you shouldn't do it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. On top of that, we've gotten the idea that we should never be uncomfortable.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00And if we are uncomfortable, we should soothe that very quickly.
SPEAKER_01Right. We should never feel uncomfortable. So the phone is a great self soother, right? The screens we can disappear into that. And it's also a good cover story. I can't deal with you right now because I'm looking at something more important. I'd love it to give you eye contact, but I just can't. I'm so important. Yeah. I don't have time. And you see, and it's not just kids doing this, not just young people. Everybody. Everybody. They want to be in their screen. And in fact, it's so normal that when somebody does talk to you, you figure they're about to rob you.
SPEAKER_00Totally.
SPEAKER_01So you're gonna rob me. No, I just asked you how you were, you know, enjoying the weather today.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, okay. I'm checking my wallet. I know how much money was in my wallet.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_01You charlatan. Charlatan? Charlatan?
SPEAKER_00Charlatan.
SPEAKER_01You charlatan. That sounds like a cigarette. I don't know what I'm saying. So one simple definition for friendship is just find someone who you like to hang out with and you can feel relaxed around them.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You don't have to feel like you're auditioning with them.
SPEAKER_00Yes. If I trip over my words and you're like, that didn't come out right, hold on, back restart, back up, and that your friend is like, yeah, you're a human. Yeah, and and that doesn't that's not a comment on your character.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00Because I know who you are. That you like you were a human and your words came out funny.
SPEAKER_01You have a track record with me.
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01And so your emotional bank account. Yeah, yeah. And so you're, you know, you're allowed to have some withdrawals.
SPEAKER_00You get to be, yeah, totally right. You get to be a messy human who makes mistakes. Right. And I, yeah.
SPEAKER_01I think the other thing is that, and I I think this is true, the older you get, is that we quickly judge, you know, whether someone is going to be a good friend or not, you know. And they just come in so many different packages. Yes. Like we think we want this kind of person, but you know, when we sit around and talk to people, they surprise us. Yeah. The people we've written off because they're too old, they're too weird, they're dressing funny, they have an accent, they you know, they don't seem to relate to my sense of humor, whatever it is. But when you really start talking to you, you realize, man, this person's super interesting.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, and they're different enough than me that I have something to learn from them, or I'm curious about them in a different way.
SPEAKER_01There's there's magic just around the corner. Yeah. And you can't, you know, cut somebody off, you can't cut them short before you had a chance to hear that one story that's gonna unlock your curiosity and your interest.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So what I hear in there is like, you know, is there something wrong with me if I don't have a quote unquote good friend?
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00It's like, well, how are we thinking about friendship? How are we giving ourselves the opportunity to connect with people that maybe we wouldn't otherwise? Like, are we giving ourselves the space to be curious, to maybe have a friend that doesn't isn't the age or the look or the style or the whatever that we thought we were looking for. Right. And that mm maybe if we broaden our thinking, we find something delightful.
SPEAKER_01I think a couple of things. So if you're older, I think you need to get out of the house. You mentioned that. You need to take classes or workshops, you need to go somewhere. And if you don't have the scratch, then there's plenty of free stuff for you to go to, right? Hang out where people are, join some groups, whatever they are, whatever their your interests might be, there's a group for it, I guarantee you. And there's certainly gonna be an online group. Yes, yep, but in-person is better if you can find it. And if you got none of that, you can always do volunteer stuff. Yeah. And if you like animals or you like whatever cleaning up trash, next thing you know, you're gonna meet somebody, right? Yeah. And then of course, sports and things like that. There's so many other things, but you I think you have if you really want to meet somebody when you're older, you're gonna have to get out there. Because when you're younger, you're out there all the time and you're in all these groups all the time.
SPEAKER_00You know what though? I have young women in my life that I get to spend time with that has become a kind of a family member of mine. And she's in her 20s, and she talks about how hard it is to make the kinds of friends she wants in her age group.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I wonder how much COVID impacted that age group. I wonder how much social media and all those things, because she's struggling, and I was like, that's so interesting. She and I have had multiple conversations about trying hard to find friendships and having them work out for a little while and then not be a good fit anymore. And so I think at each age group it has its own challenges.
SPEAKER_01Right. Exactly. This idea that we're on a quest to find that one or two really good friends, as opposed to a quest to find some friends and then see how that develops.
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_01Because as you said, you're not gonna know right away if they're your good, good buddy. No, you're not gonna know that anyway. You hear people say that. Oh, I met this person at this retreat, and within one hour I could tell we were gonna be best friends forever. Well, that happens, but it's not common. No, you don't know until you have you might be excited about that person right away, but you don't know what kind of friend they're gonna be for a long time. Because you have to do, you have to travel the path.
SPEAKER_00Well, again, it's friend dating. If you met a person and within an hour you were like, I'm going to marry this person, don't get me wrong, people do it, and it works out for some people, right? But mostly it doesn't.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00Right? So I think the same with friends to be like, ooh, I found someone I'm very excited about. I'm really curious about this friendship and where it's gonna go, and you just gather time with them. Would you also agree that it's okay to move on to certain friends that just for whatever reason the fits just let them fit, and also you don't have to do anything about it, you can just let it fade.
SPEAKER_01There's no well that sometimes works, but the other person may not want it to fade, so they're working extra hard.
SPEAKER_00Sometimes, and sometimes you have to say something, but sometimes everybody can just agree to let it fade and that's okay.
SPEAKER_01Right. Right. Especially when it's yeah, when everyone's kind of worn out from it. Right.
SPEAKER_00You're like, oh, we'll just let this fade and that's okay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And I think that's important too, is to not feel like you have to like it's okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01It's okay that you know you had something in common with someone at some point in your life, and now it's become sort of like an obligation. You don't really feel that same connection anymore. And either you've changed or they've changed or the world's changed, whatever it is. It happens, it's there's no crime being committed here.
SPEAKER_00No, and there's nobody, not a good guy and bad guy there. It just happens. Well, they're the bad guy. Well, sure, every time.
SPEAKER_01You're always the good guy.
SPEAKER_00I am always the good guy.
SPEAKER_01You're always the good guy. Tracy, I it's been really cool to talk to you about this. I want to thank you for bringing your expertise to a problem that many of us face. Thank you everyone for listening. Please let us know if you enjoy the show. We love hearing from you. Uh email is in the show notes, and you can contact us on Instagram, and we hope you will tune in to another episode. Because whether you are burying a body for a friend, or just another troll in a twisted DD meetup, it's important to remember that we all smell like humans. Bye everybody. Bye. Twisted trolls! Twisted meetups.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I have to stand up for a minute.