SPEAKER_03 0:00

Well, I'm not gonna take a a 90s poop. I'm not gonna read a shampoo bottle. You gotta read something.

SPEAKER_00 0:11

Uh we don't wanna take a 90s poop anytime.

SPEAKER_01 0:15

Welcome to another episode of Smells Like Humans. This is the podcast where we explore the curious things that people do, the very human things that grab our attention and cause us to wonder, what and why? I'm Ross, your host, and my guest today is so exotic. If she were a tree, she'd be a rainbow eucalyptus tree. It's Jamie. Hi Jamie.

SPEAKER_03 0:44

Hi Ross.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Did you know that the uh rainbow eucalyptus tree has an outer bark that peels away in strips and it reveals a bright inner trunk that shifts in color from pastel green to deep orange. Just like me. Purple and maroon.

SPEAKER_03 1:03

I love it. I've never heard of such a thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

I've always assumed that you had a bright inner trunk. Yes. I also want to point out, although this is apropos of nothing, that you are comfortably situated in your house crocs.

SPEAKER_03 1:19

Yeah, I did forget to change out of my house crocs before.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

It was so funny. We're coming into the studio and Jamie goes, Oh, I'm wearing my house crocs.

SPEAKER_03 1:29

As one does.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

As one does. And we all should be comfortable in our house crocs. Welcome to all of you. Whether you're in house crocs or not, you're welcome here. We're glad you're here. And we want to get started. So, Jamie, we know that people like to carry their phone everywhere. Am I right? Yes. That's what we do. In fact, there are some people experimenting living with what's called a dumb phone. You know any of these people?

SPEAKER_03 1:59

I don't know what that means.

SPEAKER_01 2:01

That's a phone that doesn't do anything. So make calls and maybe some basic texting. Uh-huh. And some people are experimenting with this to see if it makes their life a little better. But the people doing this realize pretty quickly they can't operate in the real world anymore. Okay. You can't read a menu in a lot of places because you can't scan anything. You can't pay a bill, you got no GPS. So you're walking around with those big giant maps that people used to have.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Like a map quest, you print it out. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

Oh, that's beaver, but people used to have actual maps and they'd have to low know how to read them. Right. So that you know, that's what they're stuck with. They have very difficult, you know, it's very difficult to text, to email, you can forget about that. And then, like, if you're somewhere and you need an access code to get into your account, no, you're not getting no code. Right. You're not getting anything. Right. And if someone leaves their phone behind someplace, they'll break out into a bigger sweat, faster than a sumo wrestler looking for a baloney stack in a dark room. Jamie. Yes. How would you say you're doing with your relationship with your phone? It's bad. It's really bad.

SPEAKER_03 3:09

I have my phone on me at all times and I constantly am checking it. You know, you get the alerts where it's like, this is how much screen time you had for average for the week or whatever. It's horrifying. Yeah, it's really, really bad.

SPEAKER_01 3:24

Well, I think that puts you right squarely in the middle of what the world is doing right now. I think you're not that different from everyone else. We all are carrying our phone around, we all are over-engaged. We might be having a great conversation, and two things happen. That's what I was gonna say. So two things happen. One is they will just find a reason to look at their phone. Yeah. Like, oh, I've just got to check. Uh-huh. But the other thing I see, even if they're like trying really hard not to like be scrolling and checking for likes or whatever they're doing, as soon as any reason comes up for them for them to look up something, uh-huh, they'll look it up. Yeah. It's like, oh God, this is a reason. You can see how it's doing. Right. They're filled with joy. Oh, you wanted to know who who was that singer in the 70s who wore the headband? Uh-huh. Olivia, Newton John, right here on my phone. And now I've got my phone out, so what else can I do? Oh now I'll scroll for my right. And so I I feel like even with people, even for people who mean well and are trying really hard, it's really hard to put these things down. And it's the would you say that describes you? Yeah. If you and I were out to dinner and we were grabbing a grinder, uh-huh. You and I are grabbing a grinder, uh-huh. And how much time would elapse before you got involved with your phone in some way?

SPEAKER_03 4:56

I guess it depends. If if we're having like a flowing conversation, I probably wouldn't grab my phone, but if there's a lull. If I if I don't hit my mark one time, my phone is out. My mind if my mind starts to wander, the phone's coming out.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

Forget it, Dexter. You're boring me with your stories. Nobody cares what happened. By the way, do you remember the time before? I can't remember now if you ever had time before. Did you remember the before the phone? Before the phone.

SPEAKER_03 5:27

Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think my first cell phone, it wasn't a smartphone. It was one that had like, you know, like a pixelated image of like a phone that would go back and forth when somebody would call you, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:38

Oh yeah, yeah. Like the little Nokia or something. I think that's a good idea.

SPEAKER_03 5:42

It was a Nokia thing, I think. And we got text messages, I think, but you had to pay for the text messages. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:51

No smartphone.

SPEAKER_01 5:52

I remember my first phone had a cord and an analog dial, not even push button. So think about that. Oh, come on. When you were calling your girlfriend over and over, your finger would be sore. You had sore fingers. But I remember resisting the smartphone initially. Yeah. Because I noticed it was making people act strangely. Where people would they would do the sneak, they would have it under the table. So you'd be with people and you'd be looking down, and what are you doing? What are you doing? They were reading their emails or whatever. And that was before there was all the junk that they can do now, like Instagram and scrolling all their sites. Uh-huh. I drank the Kool-Aid and got a smartphone, and now I'm just like everybody else.

SPEAKER_03 6:44

I think I resisted the smartphone initially because I just assumed that it was like like the mini bar at a hotel that I was gonna go bankrupt if I got if you got the smartphone, you know.

unknown 6:56

Oh man.

SPEAKER_03 6:56

No, you can't crack into the mini bar. It's gonna bankrupt our whole family.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

I missed the mini bar is becoming a thing of the past. They hardly have them anymore. I once was at a place where they had the mini bar, like fully stocked with all the little bottles, alcohols, and candy bars and stuff. And I'm in there like hunting around. I like to see what's in there. Like, what's is there anything that's gonna tempt me besides those $8,000 macadamia? Like, what else is in here? And so I kind of picked up everything, looked at. I didn't touch, I mean, I didn't eat anything, drink anything. I go down to check out, and there's like a $500 bill for anytime you move something, it would bring up a charge. I'm like, what kind of a system is this? Right, come on. I I I think I did it, they didn't make it.

SPEAKER_03 7:43

I'll never financially recover from this.

SPEAKER_01 7:45

I know, but now the mini bar is blow chunks because you go in there, you go in there and the thing is empty. Right. I hate that. Yeah, put a bag of MMs in there.

SPEAKER_03 7:55

Card me $20 for my MMs.

SPEAKER_01 7:57

Come on, I need a Clark bar at midnight. I like the thing is, you know, it's hard to sleep in a hotel sometimes. Yeah, you know you're getting bed bugs. Oh, yeah. So come on, give me an O. Henry or something. I gotta get something to make my life better. Okay. So I do every once in a while, intentionally will go out without my phone. Can you do that? Can you go? I would never. I've done it. I've done, I've gone on like a walk, I've gone to an event, and I just leave it at home. I watch too much true crime for that. Yeah, because you've got to be. I'm gonna get murdered if I leave my phone at home. I just assume I've learned about another safety concern about carrying our phones around. Any idea what that is?

SPEAKER_03 8:45

Is it that the FBI is always watching you through your camera?

SPEAKER_01 8:49

That's true. They're always watching you and listening to you and tracking you. My feeling about that is I'm safety in numbers. You know, they got hundreds of millions of people to worry about.

SPEAKER_03 9:01

I'm not that interesting.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

I can't be the worst one. No. I mean, I'm probably kind of bad. Yeah, I'm doing some weird stuff, but someone's doing something weirder. I'm down the list. Yeah. That's my thought. Right. So a few years ago, you and I had an interesting conversation about the history and evolution of public restrooms. You may remember this.

SPEAKER_03 9:24

I recall.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

The episode was called, I think what a Horrible Way to Go. Okay. So you you should listen to that if you haven't already. And even if you listen to it, listen to it again, because I'm sure you don't remember it, but it had some good stuff in there, like the history of toilet paper. Yeah. And who wouldn't need to know that? Right. So here's the thing that we're worrying about now. With all the other things we have to worry about right now in the world, we have to worry now about the poop phone. So the question here for you and for everyone out there: do you take your phone into the bathroom with you? You can be honest here. I mean, you have to judge you.

SPEAKER_03 10:06

You have to.

SPEAKER_01 10:07

And so the question is, what makes you say you have to?

SPEAKER_03 10:11

Well, I'm not gonna take a 90s poop. I'm not gonna read a shampoo bottle. You gotta read something.

SPEAKER_00 10:22

Uh we don't want to take a 90s poop anytime. For a miniature, I thought that was slang. I'm like, what are we talking about? I took a 90s poop in there, I would not go in there.

SPEAKER_03 10:34

No, in the 90s, I feel like you had like National Geographic on the back of the toilet. You know, you had like magazines you would read. Right. But there's so much more on the internet.

SPEAKER_01 10:46

Yes, there's so much more to do, and so much, so many more ways to be engaged. So, yeah, so that's what most people would say. And I too am guilty of bringing a phone into the bathroom until I started learning about the problem of the poop phone. So the poop particles. Yeah, well, what you're getting ahead of me there, doctor. The most likely people to take a phone into the bathroom are young adult males, Gen Zs or millennials. Statistically, they're the most likely to be on the poop phone. 90% of millennials, 96% of Gen Z use their phones in the bathroom compared to a much smaller fraction of older generations. Men, more frequent offenders than women, they call them offenders in this article. That was funny. 80% of men admit to using their phone on the toilet. So you know it's 100%.

SPEAKER_03 11:46

100%.

SPEAKER_01 11:47

Yeah, because men lie compared to 69% of the women. We don't believe that's true. I don't believe that's true. Right. Men are also nearly twice as likely to report bringing their phone in the bathroom every single time.

SPEAKER_03 12:04

Yeah. Every time. I bring it in every time. Every time. Every single time. So I've even texted in the shower. I bring my phone.

SPEAKER_01 12:13

Well, you are a bold and sassy minx.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Um, that I don't know how you do that. Is your phone waterproof?

SPEAKER_03 12:24

It's water resistant.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Okay. And you just test that.

SPEAKER_03 12:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:30

At some point.

SPEAKER_03 12:30

I like to push the boundaries. You know?

SPEAKER_01 12:33

My phone is resisting this water. That is my dream. So we want to know what are the personality traits of these chronic bathroom phone users. And then we're going to talk about why we might want to think about it. So these are people with low boredom tolerance. The idea of sitting around waiting for the 90s poop is too much. And they say, I've got to have some kind of stimulation. Okay. And then they have high FOMO. They don't want to miss anything that might be going on right now. Okay. In their on their sites or in their feeds, right? Yep. Gotta stay in the loop. Anyone could text me at any minute. What if somebody texts me a question?

SPEAKER_03 13:15

Well, I'm in the shower. Yeah, and I'm in the shower. I shall respond.

SPEAKER_01 13:18

Yeah, I need to be there. I need to be ready because if you delay anything over 14 seconds, you will be canceled.

SPEAKER_03 13:27

One time I was in the shower and I have an Apple Watch, and my brother had texted me, and the water droplets from the shower hit the auto reply. Oh. And I'm learning Spanish right now. Oh no. So it responded to him and just said no, gracias to whatever he said.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

Oh my goodness. Donde está el baño. So habit loop formation, what is that? So for many, reaching for the phone when standing up or walking toward the bathroom is a subconscious, automatic reflex. It's like having a baby. This is what it reminded me of. Have you had a baby? Never. I've had a baby, not myself. But there was a baby in my midst. Uh-huh. And you just don't leave it when it's a baby. You just don't leave it like by the side of the road, you know, or something. You always pick up the baby. If it's on the road, you pick it up. Okay. I think if I were you, I'd be thinking, isn't bringing your phone into the bathroom just the same as bringing a book?

SPEAKER_02 14:39

A national geographic.

SPEAKER_01 14:41

National geographic, a newspaper, one of those giant foldable maps. Isn't it just the same? And the experts who have studied the poop phone phenomenon say that, yeah, those are the same basic things, the same habits. You know, you want to have something to do. You just don't want to be sitting there like a goob.

SPEAKER_03 15:02

Staring into the abyss.

SPEAKER_01 15:03

Yeah, riding the porcelain pony with nothing to do. Like, what am I? What what what does my life become? So, I mean, you don't want to sit there humming because that's weird. That's weird. And people who hum in the bathroom, stop it. Just stop doing it. I live in a building, I can hear stuff through the walls. I don't want to hear. I don't want to hear what people are doing. Anyway, so they want to avoid boredom. They know they're going to be sitting around for a while. So what's the difference? So bring a phone in the bathroom, same kind of thing, just like people who bring in a book. And here are the three major differences, though. So not so fast, house crocs. First thing, and this is the thing that we all need to be thinking about from now on is porosity. Porosity, there's a word for you. So paper products are porous and absorbent. While they can catch airborne particles, bacteria like E. coli or Salmonella generally do not live long on dry paper surfaces. So the poop droplets will land on your books, but they don't live very long.

SPEAKER_03 16:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:15

The smartphones, however, are made of non-porous glass, plastic, and metal germs thrive on these smooth surfaces. I would have thought the opposite. While you leave a magazine in the bathroom or throw a newspaper away, your phone goes directly from the bathroom stall to your face, your bed, your kitchen table without ever being washed. Yeah. So you think you're just innocently scrolling on Instagram while you're doing your thing, but you're actually creating a petri dish that you're gonna carry around with you. And you know, you're gonna like, oh, there's my friend, I'll give him a hug, or I'll now it's time to get Junior off to school. Let me comb his hair. And the whole time, anything you are touching or around, you're smearing with poop particles. Yep. So this is a problem. The other thing is that, you know, with a phone, because you're constantly like swiping it with your fingers, you're touching, if you're in a public restroom, you're touching like the stall door. All this stuff is covered with these particles already from people, you know, right doing what they need to do in there. So anything you touch is we've talked about this before, you know, the poop fingers and everything. So, you know, you're covered with it. So when you touch that screen, it's contaminated. You put it against your face. Now your face is contaminated. So, you know, like five minutes you're out of the restroom. I come over to visit, I don't know where you've been, and I didn't know you were on your poop phone. And then you come up and you give me a hug and you press your cheek against my cheek, I'm getting a poop cheek, and I don't even know it.

SPEAKER_03 18:08

It's a good thing I never answer my phone.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

Yes. You don't like a poop cheek. You don't like never answer my phone. This woman has no poop cheek. I will not tolerate anyone who suggests otherwise. I do when I go out of a bathroom and I wash my hands, but a lot of times, like the towel dispenser doesn't work, and you're left like an idiot with wet hands. Or maybe you just don't do the greatest job of drying. And then if I actually come out and then I actually have a reason to shake somebody's hand, this has happened more than you think. Uh-huh. And my hands are a little wet. I always say, Don't worry, it's good wet. Because I think there's good wet and bad wet of the bathroom. Right. And I've tried to tell people it's good wet. Now, they don't always look relieved when I tell them that. This is good, wet, don't worry. Wait, why is it wet at all? Yeah, why is it wet? Where have you been? And why are we talking about this right now?

SPEAKER_03 19:04

Speaking of wet, the last time I had to replace my phone was because I had it in my pocket and I went to the bathroom and it fell out of my pocket and it went directly into the toilet.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

So not so water resistant after all.

SPEAKER_03 19:20

Well, I use those like bleach tablets in the tank, and I think that that the chemicals are what's in it.

SPEAKER_01 19:25

I have no idea what a bleach tablet does.

SPEAKER_03 19:27

Oh, it just m makes your toilet smell nice.

SPEAKER_01 19:31

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

And clean.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

Well, that's good. Maybe it helps kill some of the floating germs.

SPEAKER_03 19:36

Right.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

So that's part of the problem. That's not the only problem. So having the poop phone isn't just bad for you because you're spreading your yours and other germs all over the place. The thing is, when you're when you've got a phone, there's no end. Yeah. You never get to the end of the 3,000 sites. You never get to the end of looking up the facts. You never get to the end of anything, it just goes on infinitely forever. Whereas with a book or a magazine article or a newspaper, at some point you kind of like, okay, I finished that chapter. Okay, read that article, whatever, you're done. So the phones are hijacking your attention, and so people stay on the toilet longer and longer because now you forgot why you're there.

SPEAKER_03 20:33

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:34

Whether you've done what you need to do or not, you're just like, this is kind of quiet in here. Nobody's bugging me. I'm in my own space. I'll call this my office. You know, this is my playroom. This is my man cave. Until your legs fall asleep. Yeah, until your legs fall asleep. So doctors warn, and you know doctors with their warnings, they're always warning. Sitting on the toilet seat for more than 10 to 15 minutes creates intense, prolonged pressure on the rectum. And why is that bad? It sounds bad already to me. Like I don't need, I don't need any more information. I don't need any more information. But that significantly increases the risk of developing hemorrhoids and rectal prolapse.

SPEAKER_03 21:22

That sounds bad.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

Yeah, that's not something you want to see on your menu. Today we're offering hemorrhoids.

SPEAKER_03 21:30

And rectal prolapse.

SPEAKER_01 21:31

Yeah, you might want to, uh Chef recommends the rectal prolapse. Clearly, if you are taking phone into the bathroom, at the minimum, you want to clean your screen with like one of those little wipes.

SPEAKER_02 21:46

Alcohol wipe.

SPEAKER_01 21:46

Yeah, alcohol wipes, but also the whole phone needs to be wiped down. Yeah. Or maybe just keep it not out. Like, don't take it out. But that doesn't solve your problem of wanting to look at it. So then if If you are gonna do it, then you have to spend less only spend the amount of time in there that you need. Don't overspend your time because you're in a relaxing situation. Sure. It's also bad as you get older for like lower back because you're kind of stooped over, and so your spine is through all this stress. Whenever your head is forward and your shoulders, I'm trying to demonstrate it. And your rectum's out. Your rectum is prolapsing. Your rectum is prolapsing, and your hemorrhoids are roiding out. So you need to, you you need you so you get into this hunch, like this hunchback thing, and that's bad for you too. And it's that you causes back pain and all these things. So I get it. I think one of the most important things to me about the fact that we all have to go to the bathroom is it guarantees me a little quiet time. Right. Close the door. Now, I've told you before, I it's so important to me because I grew up in a big family, and you could not go into the bathroom, you would not be in there 40 seconds before some sucker was jiggling the handle. I hate the handle jiggle. Yeah. Or I hate the door like somebody trying to break the door like I'd lock.

SPEAKER_03 23:23

I always lock the door even if I'm home by myself. And what's the replacement? I don't know. I just assume somebody's gonna try to walk in.

SPEAKER_01 23:31

One of the remaining life pleasures is to have a reason to be by yourself. Now, I I don't think you're one of these. If everything I know about you suggests you're not one of these double, let's all use the bathroom at the same time, people. But I know that you know probably know people who do this, or do you not? That are just comfortable, like, yeah, you come in and you get ready for work and I'll be here and we'll talk.

SPEAKER_03 23:57

Yeah, I don't, I'm not into it.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

Yeah, no, I just I need that time. Yeah. I mean, if somebody's in there with me, I mean, I might as well be painting the bathroom because that's all I'm not doing anything. We need our phones. We all are addicted to our phones, and it's too bad in a way. I I hate that. I hate that reflexive thing where I always feel like have to have my phone. Oh, I don't have my phone. Where's my phone? I hate the panic when you think you've left your phone. Yeah. I hate that we can't do like so. For a lot of people, if they lose their phone, they can't pay for anything, they can't call, they can't do anything. Yeah. And I I hate feeling like this is what it means to be a modern person in the world. I gotta carry this stupid thing around or I can't do anything. I don't like it. I want something better. Yeah. Either chip us for real, uh-huh, or do retinal scans so that I can pay like you just I look, I just stare at stuff camera, uh-huh, and then they say you're good. And that's what they're doing at the airport. I went to the airport, they I said, Do you want to see my ID? No. Do you want to see my ticket? No.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

You know, your not your ticket, what do they call it now, your boarding pass?

SPEAKER_02 25:16

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

They no, they want to see anything. Just look into the camera and we'll tell you if you're good.

unknown 25:22

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 25:23

And I'm like, okay, so that's what I did. And I'm not in, I'm not in any kind of face thing. Uh-huh. They just already know what my they've already they got me in the database. Crazy. So, and what I was saying is, I am sympathetic. We're all in this boat together with these phones, but you need to be safe out there. You need to be safe. If you're carrying your phone with you, carry your alcohol wipes. Don't they make those conveniently now? Wipe it down before you pick up that baby off the road, before you hug Aunt May, before you prepare a lunch for your lovely partner, before you make those home-baked cookies with your fingers in the dough. Wipe that bone down. Well, thank you, Jamie, for being here and giving. I think, I think uh we've we're helping people.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:20

I think we help people now. Sure. We're doing a public service. We're talking about the things that people need to know about. Yeah, and thank you to all of you for joining us for this episode. Please share the show with someone you think might enjoy. That is the best way to help us right now. And we hope you will tune in to another episode because whether you are just working on a 90s poop or just someone chilling in their house crocs, it's important to remember that we all smell like humans. Bye, everybody.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

He froze.

SPEAKER_01 26:55

I'm frozen. I'm frozen. I just started thinking about why don't I own a pair of house crocs?